Dr. Chopo Mwanza is the pastor at Faith Baptist Church Riverside in Kitwe, Zambia. He was recently our keynote speaker at the Harvest missions conference.
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Transcript
Chris Harper: Welcome to Harvest Time. My name is Chris Harper, and our host on this program is Pastor Gary Walton, the lead pastor of Harvest Baptist Church. Every week, we spend these twenty five minutes together telling you the stories of our church by interviewing our members and other friends of the ministry. We have two services at Harvest every week, The first at 08:45AM, the second at 10:45AM on Sunday. We have Japanese and Korean translation during our 10:45AM service.
That’s also when we livestream at hbcguam.org. Hbcguam.org. We really hope you can join us this week at Harvest. Let’s begin harvest time today by welcoming pastor Gary Walton. Hi, pastor.
Gary Walton: Hey. Hafa adai, Chris.
We’re still reveling in the joy of what we experienced at Missions Conference just recently at Harvest and really thankful for the ways that God directed both the speakers and our theme and our spirit altogether, just praying that God would use those conversations, both the formal ones in services and the ones around tables and in our campus to continue to ignite our hearts for the call of Missions. We actually felt like we wanted to take advantage of the speakers that we had here, so even though Missions Conference is done, today in the studio we have Dr. Chopo Mwanza with us and I want to talk with him today, which will allow us, to continue this conversation. So as you’re listening, I know it’s a week or so past our conference, but hopefully these conversations will keep the themes of what we learned together ongoing for us. So give them some roots that they’d sit down with us.
Dr. Mwanza, first of all, can I say again, thank you for coming all the way to Guam? I know it was a journey for you. Thank you for that.
Chopo Mwanza: Thank Mwanza you. It’s good to be here and thank you for having me. I’ve thoroughly enjoyed my time.
Gary Walton: Well, we’ve enjoyed it, too. It’s been just so full and rich. The friendship together, but the ministry partnership. We have been connected with you and the ministry secondarily, for a long time.
Dr. Mwanza is a pastor of Faith Baptist Church in Kitwe, Zambia, and also the incoming, or I think you’re calling it the president designate for CABU, Central Africa Baptist University. And it’s a university that Harvest has been connected with for a long time through our missionary Phil Hunt, who’s been connected there in Zambia. He’s been here on campus a couple of different times. So we’ve been praying for you, literally, and for the ministry now for a number of years.
And we’re just we’re thrilled to be able to have you here. It’s fruit of the next generation of that leadership.
Chopo Mwanza: Amen. Amen. It’s been blessing to be here. I’ve heard of the work and the ministry here for a number of years. I’ve met, a number of people, who were here some years ago when they visited Zambia.
So it’s been a blessing to finally visit and see and meet your brethren here.
Gary Walton: Yeah, it’s been fantastic. And we’ve thoroughly enjoyed the ministry of the Word. Thank you for bringing the Word so faithfully, passionately, and God has used that in the life of our church we’ll maybe ask you some questions here in a minute.
Chopo Mwanza: Sure.
Gary Walton: Let’s back it all the way up. Tell us about your family, first of all. We would love to have your wife here. But tell us about your wife and kids.
Chopo Mwanza: Married to Kunda, and the Lord has blessed us with three children, a girl and two boys, ages nine, seven, and four. And they all have bithdays coming up in the next few weeks.
Gary Walton: Oh, good. Would you be back?
Chopo Mwanza: You’d I definitely will be. Yeah.
Gary Walton: Important. Glad that you’re going to be back. Yeah. Give us their names.
Chopo Mwanza: The names are Tionge, Yamikani and Tendai.
Gary Walton: Okay.
Chopo Mwanza: Yeah. Great.
Gary Walton: Any meaning for the names or just kind of common names? Yes.
Chopo Mwanza: So actually, they all basically mean the same thing, which is give thanks to the Lord. Wow. So Tionge is let’s give thanks. Yamikan is let’s give praise. And Tendai is thanks be to God.
Gary Walton: Ah, wow. Love that. Well, who knows? Maybe sometime in this world God will connect us together to be able to connect your children as well and your wife. Okay, so let’s back us up even beyond that.
Tell us your story. Growing up, what’s your background in Zambia, just family wise, and then how did God you know, draw you to himself?
Chopo Mwanza: Yeah. I grew up in a Christian religious family, raised by a single mother. And my grandmother and they were both devoted churchgoers. So grew up going to church, memorizing verses in Sunday school, winning prizes for memorizing verses, but didn’t really know the Lord. And I grew up doubting the love of God until someone shared from John three explaining what it means to be born again and how God demonstrated his love for us by sending his son to come die for us.
And I I mean, it was something I had heard before, and I just remember being struck with the realization that God actually loves me. That’s what the Lord used to cause me to confess my sin and trust in Christ for salvation.
Gary Walton: Zambia, where you were at, the Christian faith, the church, would this be sort of common culturally?
Chopo Mwanza: a fairly conservative culture. A lot of people would identify themselves as Christians, and a lot of people will go to some church on the weekend. So it’s fairly common, but the understanding of the Gospel is often shallow, and a lot of it is just mere religion. When it comes to biblical Christianity, numbers kind of drop, a lot of people would be religiously Christian.
Gary Walton: Yeah. A little bit of a sidelight, but just for people to get context. You’re part of Zambia. You grew up in a city, in a country. You know, Zambia like?
Chopo Mwanza: Yeah. Zambia has the village setting. It has the so the village setting will be very rural, like no electricity, no running water, in some cases grass thatched houses. Then it would have what we call compounds and townships.
So these would be high density areas, very basic social amenities. And then we’ll also have urban areas. So just your cities, your towns developed with all the necessary social amenities.
Gary Walton: Okay. Yeah. And you grew up in what? Both. Both.
Chopo Mwanza: Yeah. Alright. Different stages of life. Okay.
Gary Walton: So Very good.
Chopo Mwanza: Yeah. I’ve experienced all all three.
Gary Walton: Yeah. Yeah. So you mentioned, single mom. Yeah. Tell me about what it was of your mom’s faith.
And did you say your grandmother too? Is that what you mentioned? Yeah. Which, you know, just puts us connected with Timothy and others in the New Testament. Yeah.
What did your, we’re talking now to some single moms out there, single dads, who love their kids, would love for them to grow up, to follow after Jesus. There’s some challenges in being a single parent household. What did your mom and your grandma do that were very instrumental for you?
Chopo Mwanza: They they were faithful going to church. That that that was just a given. Grew up every Sunday. We went to church. They served in the whatever church they were in.
My my mother loved singing. Mhmm. She sang in the house. She sang at church. She sang whenever she’s doing anything, and it dropped off.
I sing in the house. I sing whenever I’m doing anything. I I break off singing in some weird places. I once broke off singing in the bunk while I was waiting for for the tailor. And and, you know, I had to catch myself because I but but it’s it’s it’s those it’s it’s those simple, mundane, ordinary, Christian activities that that they just did faithfully.
And then, of course, there are certain character traits and virtues that that they, drilled in me. Just be honest, you know, deal with people rightly. You know, my mom had a had a sticker in her bedroom with Romans twelve eighteen, as much as depends on you, be at peace with all men. Wow. And I remember as a young boy reading that and thinking, and it stuck with me.
Yeah. So so it’s those it’s those kinds of things.
Gary Walton: Real real life, real Christian, genuine life that yeah. It’s just that theme over and over again for second generations. They see the reality of this is not just church parents. These are the faith lived out in our home in genuine, loving ways.
Dr. Chopo, how about the church? What did the church do that helped you as a young boy? You thought a dad figure? Yeah. Anything special?
Chopo Mwanza: Yeah. I mean, it’s just faithfulness of character, consistency in service. I remember one man in the church who put me aside as a teenager because I always went to church late. One Sunday I walk in, I think I was walking in, service was halfway through. And before I walked in, he was standing by the door.
He put me aside and said to me, Why did you come late? And I didn’t have an answer. And he just said, don’t come late. You know what time the service starts? Come early.
Since then, I’m always early for church. So it’s it’s those kinds of things. It’s seeing men, saving ten, fifteen, twenty years. Yeah. And and you you think, wait a minute, it’s been twenty years and this man does the same thing Mhmm.
Over and over consistently. Mhmm. It’s it’s watching men love their wives and care for their children. Again, it’s basic Christian life lived out consistently over a period of time and consistency of character that that strikes, you know, just, you know, it’s vivid. Or it’s someone saying something to you, pulling you aside.
And and it’s those things that have had a great impact on my life.
Gary Walton: That’s so encouraging. I just think to all of us, not there wasn’t some special spectacular thing that happened. No. It was just genuine followers of Jesus living out their faith, day after day, week after week. Not perfectly, but faithfully.
I agree with you. I couldn’t agree more with you. Long continual walk in that direction towards Jesus is powerful. What’s different in the church in Africa than is here? And what can we learn from the African church?
Chopo Mwanza: One is the vibrance in in singing. Mhmm. I think as Africans, we generally are vibrant Yes, sir. In in in in our singing. We love singing.
So so that’s that’s that’s one thing that often stands out whenever Mhmm. I visit other continents is is just the the the I realized, well, we are we’re a bit bit more vibrant. The other would be Africans are generally communal, and so, just doing life together, Your your burden is my burden Yeah. Which I think is is a common grace the Lord has blessed our culture with because that’s that’s that’s biblical Christianity. So when you read the one another passages in the New Testament, it’s it’s you’re doing life corporately.
Yeah. You are a family. And and I think that’s something that’s just a a huge a huge blessing in Africa. The other different thing would be, you know, in Africa, we are not always conscious of of time. Mhmm.
You know, relationships and events are more important than the
Gary Walton: Yeah.
Chopo Mwanza: Than the time. So so there are there are certain churches where if you go to, the the service may take a while. Whereas I think this side it’s more like it’s part of the services really portion. Hey this section is five minutes. Yeah.
Yeah. In Africa you yeah, you would stress yourself.
Gary Walton: I love that. I love it.
Chopo Mwanza: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Gary Walton: Well, you know some culture there, but I agree with you. There’s some things for us to learn from God’s Church in Africa. Yeah. Yeah. That’s beautiful.
You’ve got a couple different roles there. Been pastoring Faith Baptist Church in Kitwei, and then been a part of CABU for a while. How’s your experiences shepherding the church shaped your vision for the leadership and education at CABU?
Chopo Mwanza: Yeah. Well, the church is the bride of Christ and parachurch organizations like seminaries, bible schools, are the bridesmaids. The mission of God is carried through the Church. And institutions like CABU are coming alongside the Church to support what the church is doing. There is great value when people who serve in parachurch organizations are church people.
They are members of the church. They are serving in a church. They prioritize the church so that they are then able to ensure that those institutions do not become the center. They do not want to become bridesmaids. Know, when you do weddings every now and then, there’s that bridesmaid who who
Gary Walton: That’s to be the star.
Chopo Mwanza: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And and and you always have to say, hey. You’re you’re not the bride.
And I think institutions, parachurch, institutions need to be reminded often that you are not the bride. If you close today, God’s mission will continue because God is working through the church. And I think that’s one benefit of, someone in the church and ensure making sure everyone who’s serving in these institutions, prioritize the church. They are committed to the Church.
Gary Walton: Ah, man. I love that. Thank you. Yeah, that’s really good. CABU, I think, has a vision, a burden for, and maybe even sees their place as God has grown the institution as influencing not just Kitwe, Zambia, but literally, you know, that whole part of Africa and the whole continent of Africa.
Is that right? The vision is not small.
Chopo Mwanza: Yeah, yeah. We would like to see an army of servant leaders
Gary Walton: Amen.
Chopo Mwanza: Trained for Great Commission living across the continent. 1.5 billion people in Africa and the projections are that by 2050, that number might double. So the work is great. The opportunities are many. And and we want to play a part in in in in doing that so that churches planted in every village, city, and town.
Gary Walton: Amen. Amen. Amen. We wanna pray with you that God would fulfill that vision through you and some others. And, I mean, Chopo, I mean, this this is a big conversation beyond the two of us for sure.
But I’m sure not completely foreign to you. You know, there’s some sense that among some missiologists and, you know, world sociologists that the center of the mission effort in the future may come from Africa.
Chopo Mwanza: Yep. Yep.
Gary Walton: You know, our prayer is that there would be revival in the church in America, that some of the central sending of people that has happened for a couple centuries now out of America. I’m not a cynic. I’m hopeful about that. There’s some sense of the growing army of God’s people in Africa. What would you say to that?
Chopo Mwanza: Yeah. I think there is there is a lot of truth to it and indicators pointing to it. One, you know, population growth, even just in terms of economic opportunities and indicators with all the raw materials and resources that Africa has.
But then also there is general favour and on the continent, in most countries, in terms of government restrictions, there is more freedom, religious freedom, if you may, in Africa, and even more allowance in most African countries for, Christian initiatives and endeavors to to take place. Whereas in the West, you know, you know, governments are tightening up and, and the anti Christian disposition is is growing. Africa has a more pro Christian disposition in at least Sub Saharan Africa. All those and even the age, the average age in Africa is, I think, what, 19? 19 to 23.
So very young, growing. So for the next fifty years, you have a lot of vibrant young people in in Africa, and and and the the very encouraging, very, very encouraging.
Gary Walton: I agree. Yeah. And, I listened to you preach this this week, and I’ve thought, God, raise up, continue to give platform for Dr. Chopo. I think your voice is going to be significant in what God’s going to do in the years to come.
And we feel the significance of the location here in the in the global advance. You know, we’re such a strategic location in the 10/40 window. But, I, you know, I look across the globe to that center in Zambia and some other locations, and I see the same. Maybe even, you know, of course the population is much, much larger. The army of missions that could come out of Africa.
Yeah. Prayer is that God would fill your sails and allow the ministry to thrive.
Chopo Mwanza: Amen.
Gary Walton: We’ve been thankful for your preaching, and if I could, you know, these times go so fast, if you have a message for Harvest, you’ve been with us for a few days, Is, you know, you’ve got a couple more days with us. We’re thankful for But as you head back home, what what would you how’d you like to encourage our Harvest family?
Chopo Mwanza: I I I think, one, I’ve been very encouraged at the work going on here. Just blessed my soul. Mhmm. Your commitment to the gospel, your commitment to missions, your your commitment to reaching your your community and and beyond. Mhmm.
Your commitment to support the missionaries, you’ve you’ve sent out, it it’s it’s a labor of love. I I’m going away encouraged, challenged. And and so I think one Corinthians fifteen fifty eight, would be my encouragement and that’s part of that. I was wrestling what would be my last message, and I thought, you know, they are doing good work. Just encourage them to continue.
Do not grow weary in doing well, for in due season you shall you shall reap.
Gary Walton: Amen. Yeah. It was the right tone, right on point, and God led you God led you to that. Well, really do feel the weight of this, Dr. Chopo.
I think God is going to expand your ministry in the years to come. And we’re thankful for the opportunity for this friendship, both personally but ministry wise. We hope that that grows and that mutually there’d be benefit as we try to pursue God’s will. So thank you for, again, that long trip over here. Thank you for taking that.
Thank you to your wife and your family for releasing you for that time. We’ll pray for God’s blessing.
Chopo Mwanza: Thank you for having me. It’s been my pleasure.
Chris Harper: And thank you for listening to Harvest Time. Of course, at this point in the program, we always wanna personally invite you again to services at Harvest Baptist Church on Sunday, 08:45AM and 10:45AM. You can come to either service. During the 10:45AM service, we have Japanese and Korean translation. That’s also the service we bring you live here on 88.1 FM and khmg.org.
Hope to see you this Sunday. Thanks again for listening to Harvest Time.