Pastor Michael Saunders joins us for Spirit Week at Harvest Christian Academy. He and guest host Pastor Noah Kephart discuss his time in ministry on Guam.
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Episode transcript:
Chris Harper: Welcome to Harvest Time. My name is Chris Harper, and our guest host on this program is pastor Noah Kephart. Every week, we spend these 25 minutes together telling you the stories of our church by interviewing our members and other friends of the ministry. We’d like to invite you to join us at Harvest Baptist Church this week. We have 2 services every Sunday at harvest.
The first at 8:45 AM, the second at 10:45 AM. We have Japanese and Korean translation available during the 10:45 AM service, and that’s also when we live stream at hbcguam.org, hbcguam.org. This week, pastor Larry Nagengas will be preaching in both services. Community groups will also begin this week. Let’s begin today’s harvest time by welcoming pastor Noah.
Hi, pastor Noah.
Noah Kephart: Hey, Chris. Thanks for having us on today. Excited to be here, excited to really have a conversation with pastor Michael Saunders, who, some of our listeners would would know that name, know his history at harvest. But we’re excited to have him out here. Welcome him back to Guam, just for the week.
So welcome, pastor pastor Michael Saunders.
Michael Saunders: Yeah. Thank you. Great. Glad to be here.
Noah Kephart: No. It it it’s good to have you out here.
Chris Harper: For those of you that
Noah Kephart: may not know, this week at Harvest Christian Academy is our annual spirit week where we take a week, and we we set we have challenging academics here at Harvest, but we set those to the side. And it’s really just a fun week for our students. We bring out a special speaker, so there’s a couple extra chapel sessions for the week. A lot of fun, a lot of games. We break our students, 7th through 12th grade students up into 3 teams.
There is a winner at the end of the week. There are 2 non winners. Really, it’s just a fun a fun week for our students. So pastor Saunders is out here speaking in our in our chapel sessions for the week. So pastor Saunders, you spent a little bit of time here on Guam.
We’re gonna get there. But I wanna start off at the very beginning. Where did you grow up, and how did you come to know the Lord?
Michael Saunders: Born in Detroit, Michigan. I grew up about 6 months after I was born. My my family moved to Flint, Michigan, and about an hour north of Detroit. And my dad was a pastor at Trinity Baptist Church in Flushing and grew up as a PK, pastor’s kid. Mom was a Christian school teacher, and that was kind of my world, until I was 18.
As a pastor’s kid, there were times I did not like being a pastor’s kid. I didn’t like it at all. And sometimes it’s the expectations. Sometimes maybe it’s just how you feel, but there’s some things I didn’t like about it. And hitting 7th, 8th, 9th grade were some rough years for me, in my walk with the Lord.
So when I was in 5th grade was when I trusted Jesus as my savior, realized that my parents being spiritual leaders had nothing to do with my eternal destiny. I had to realize, you know, I got an answer to the lord for myself, and I remember getting going down to my dad’s my parents’ room and my dad, kneeling with me next to their bed and asked the lord to save me. And and you thought, well, from there on out, there’s you know, it’s all rainbows. Then you didn’t, you know, hit those middle school years, and it was a real struggle spiritually and not, not liking that my parents were always in ministry, that everybody had eyes on me, and the expectations for were for me to know, you know, every passage of the Bible, and I was supposed to always obey, and I was supposed to have to have all the answers to every Sunday school question. And then, again, maybe a lot of people didn’t think that, but just sometimes some people would say that you should know better.
You’re a pastor’s kid. And that just it got to the point where, like, I don’t wanna be a pastor’s kid. Like, why can’t my dad work at the union, and then I could just go to church and just be a normal kid. And then it led to, me not liking church, and then it led to me not wanting to be there. And so my youth pastor, pastor Ron Scott, who still they just celebrated 40 years, at the same church, still at Trinity Baptist in Flushing, Michigan.
So he was my youth pastor, and we they used to have what they call snack, a Sunday night after church, and they had a little bonfire. And he sat next to me and recognized something was wrong. And we started having a conversation over the next couple weeks, just him just kindly being patient, loving on me, asking right questions, help me work through, God is good. We can get through some of these things that I don’t like, but that I could still follow him, still love him, and, and it was a real big turning point in my life. And so that led to 9th, 10th grade, Jesus kinda getting a hold of my life.
And, you know, it’s kinda weird. Not many people have that at age 16, like, knowing what you wanna do with your life. But at 16, I was like, if I could do anything, I wanna do what pastor Scott did for me. Like, he he just sat with me in one of my again, you when you’re when you’re 12, 13, 14, whatever’s big to you seems huge. Even though the rest of life, it’s it’s not that much.
But for me, that was that was a big moment in my life and his real turning point. So pastor Scott was there. He was just there. We were in his house all the time. He invited us over all the time.
We’re just in there. So Sunday night, we’re at his house, doing whatever. We’re in coming over during the summer, hanging out with him. But he listened. He helped.
He encouraged. He pushed me. I saw Rob Kinder, who I brought out here. You know, I I grew up having a youth pastor. It’s real pushy, like, in a good way.
Just things that you thought you should never not be doing. It’s in good things. Like, I I can’t do that. I’m I’m just a kid. I’m just a teen.
And he’d be like, no. You can. And I’m gonna help you do it. And then you’d start doing it, realize you can do it. And then as soon as you got past that hurdle, like, he had another one.
It’s like, alright. We’re raising the bar. And he’s pushing you to do it. It wasn’t just me as as teens all around, but I was like, man, if if Jesus would allow me to get to that place where I could just help other teens like my youth pastor did, like, I I feel like I would be living a good life. Because I was at 16.
So, again, I know that’s not for everybody, and I know that’s not everybody’s story. But he was that he’s just that big in my life. So that was that part, and so that led to I wanted to then go learn how to be a youth pastor. So that led me to, when I was 18, went to Northland Baptist Bible College, one of the greatest colleges ever ever existed. It’s not no more.
But, you know, I loved that at the time there. Doctor Ola, who was a youth pastor, my dad’s like, if you want to learn about youth ministry, you gotta learn from doctor Rowe. Because my dad knew him because they were both in Michigan. So I went and sat under doctor Rowe for 4 years, and and other godly men that were there. And and some odd reason, pastor Herron asked, you know, my senior year, my wife and I would come out and eventually, like, yeah.
So and coming out here wasn’t like a big step, and I I don’t mean that, like, in a self congratulatory way. Our youth group was taking mission trips nonstop all the time. And so my again, pastor Scott, he was a missionary teacher, came back and went to be youth pastor. Submission was high on his radar. So we were going 1 to 2 times a year, we’re going out.
So instant in inside the US and then outside the US, inside the US, outside the US. And so we were going all the time. And so, like, coming out here to work wasn’t like it’s like, you know, we’ve been on these trips all the time. It’s just part of life, and it’s part of the youth group I grew up in. And you want, like, you know, as you as a youth pastor, well, even as a kid, you want every family to feel like they have the best parents.
You want that. And same for every kid that’s in the youth group. You want them to think I have the best youth group. And and I felt like growing up, I really had the best youth group. Nobody else had a better one.
And you want that for every kid. And so and that’s that’s what I felt. I was like, man, looking back so now looking back, now that I’m now I’m old, like really old. As I was talking, I had a foot in the grave, especially the teenagers. Right?
I’m it’s like they’re watching a live dinosaur. It’s like, where did this guy come from? I thought they were extinct. But, but looking back, it and unbelievable blessing to have parents that love Jesus. Yeah.
So to have a dad that was a pastor, to have a mom that’s a Christian school teacher, and they actually cared about me spiritually, which had, you know, 7th, 8th, 9th grade, which was a bane to me. It’s a thorn in my side, looking back, going, it’s one of the greatest blessings God could ever give me besides himself. Yeah. He gave me himself. You can’t ask for anything more, but on top of that, he gave me a mom and dad that they loved each other.
They loved Jesus, and they loved me. It’s like going like, alright. Who cares where the food is? Who cares what’s above your head? Who cares what clothes you got on?
Because you you’re dealing with teens. I mean, how many of them don’t have that? Just that base. And then it makes it doesn’t mean they can’t live for Jesus, but, I mean, it’s a lot of hurdles they gotta go over, that were clear and out of my way because I had a mom and dad that were on their knees, and mom and dad that were showing me how to live. So, you know, I was overwhelmingly blessed.
And so we were out here. That got me through college, so I feel like I’m gonna go ahead of any of your questions. But so we we we graduated in May 03.
Noah Kephart: Got it.
Michael Saunders: Married in June 03, and then moved here in July ‘three. Alright. Quick change. No. That’s good.
Noah Kephart: I mean, you just answered about 15 of my questions
Michael Saunders: right here.
Noah Kephart: So Well And Glad to be here.
Michael Saunders: We’ll see you guys next next week. Yeah.
Noah Kephart: You know? Yeah. We’ll see you in a couple of years. No. No.
I mean, you mentioned a couple names there. You know, Daco is no stranger to Harvest. Been out here multiple times over the years. Still a good friend of Harvest. Pastor Herron, who was on staff at Northland, was the long, long time pastor here
Michael Saunders: at Harvest. My freshman year. Yeah. This book will change your life right here. Have I told you that?
Alright. Well, good to be here. I get to hear him say that.
Noah Kephart: So how many years was did you overlap with him at harvest before or at Northam before he
Michael Saunders: I think it was just my freshman year. Okay. So but it’s like weird connection. So pastor Scott, again my youth pastor, stopped being my youth pastor my junior year because he went to be a family pastor. And then Jeff Gerber, who was from Northland, was a senior was my youth pastor my senior year and he was an in law to, the Herons.
Noah Kephart: Okay.
Michael Saunders: And so that was a weird connection. Yeah. And I worked for so anyway, so coming to North, I think I knew some people coming in, which was helpful. Yeah. But, you know, I didn’t know where Guam was before we were talking about coming out here, and that’s not because I had a poor education.
It’s just I was just probably a poor student. So
Noah Kephart: k. So you came out here 2003. So, I mean, graduate in May Yeah. Married in June Yeah. Move across the world in July.
How did your families take I mean, obviously, they’re probably a little bit supportive of the marriage, probably supportive of the high school graduation or the college graduation. My parents
Michael Saunders: were overwhelmingly supportive. Okay. My they were blown away. Like, how on earth did you deceive this woman to marry you? Like how did you get to that point?
Noah Kephart: And your in laws, were
Michael Saunders: they were they a little they were there’s a lot of questions. Okay. A lot of questions. Okay. Like are you sure you’re making the right choice?
So, and even if she wasn’t, she went through with it. So she’s stuck now. Yeah. She said I do.
Noah Kephart: Were they supportive, I mean, moving as newlyweds across the world?
Michael Saunders: So we have godly both have godly heritages. And so when we were praying about this decision, the first people we talked to were our parents. And that’s not normal for some for some people in their twenties. But, where else would I go? Like, who else would I have pray for me about this decision than my mom and dad?
And if you know somebody that’s more spiritual than them, that loves Jesus more than them, then let me know because I’ll have them pray for me too. I’ll just add it to the list. But, my folks, Rebecca’s folks, love Jesus. Yeah. And so it’s gone, where where we ask them because we’re still under their authority as their kids.
So even though we’re 22 and felt like we knew everything, or at least I did. Shocker. Like, I felt like I knew it all. I had a degree, so that must mean something. But it we still realize, like, these are these are our parents.
This this is it’s wisdom. Yeah. And so, multitude of counselors are safety. And so say to the lord, the lord’s not gonna send mixed messages. He’ll use your authority to direct you.
And so what do you what do you think? Would you pray with us? And so that we we went and not just went with their blessing. We, we went with their encouragement. And, you know, again, it’s hard to hard to relay, like, what that means now.
Yeah. Because there’s some kids people that come and maybe their parents wonder and it’s a struggle, and they keep asking when they’re gonna return, when they need to come back. But, you know, we we had cheerleaders on that side going, go. Go live for Jesus.
Noah Kephart: Yeah.
Michael Saunders: And we’ll fan the flames even if it’s from 65,000,000 miles away or whatever it is to get back to Detroit. Yep. And also it was great.
Noah Kephart: Yeah. Okay. So so where did where did your wife, Rebecca, grow up?
Michael Saunders: She grew up so High Point in in Pennsylvania.
Noah Kephart: Okay.
Michael Saunders: Yeah. So in Redding, so just outside Philly. Okay. So she grew up at High Point. Her dad was a Christian school teacher.
Her mom was an editor for a Christian magazine, and and she came to Northland. We met at Northland. You’re talking about the hub. We met outside, then coffee shop. She does not remember our first meeting.
I do. So I was very well aware of who I was meeting and why I was meeting her. So she does not recall that meeting at all because I was just another knucklehead in the way to whatever building she was going to that was trying to probably impress her. Yeah. So it obviously did not make an impression.
So Okay.
Noah Kephart: But she ended up dating, engaged, married. Yeah. Yeah.
Michael Saunders: Okay. Praise, praise, praise, praise. Amen. Amen.
Noah Kephart: So so, I mean, she grew up, you know, kinda middle of Pennsylvania. You grew up Detroit area, just outside Detroit, Flint. You guys moved to Guam. It’s warmer here. You walk yeah.
The winters is it’s a blessing during January, February. What was your first impression of Guam and of the ministry here at Harvest? If you can remember that far back. I just said that, like, it’s, like, it’s such a long time ago. That’s 20 1 year.
Old.
Michael Saunders: Yeah. World. Thanks for bringing that up.
Noah Kephart: You’re welcome.
Michael Saunders: No. Coming out here so, obviously, growing up in Flint Town, you’re not gonna have the same multicultural aspect that you have here. And so I also grown up. So there’s the the positives of having a dad who’s a pastor that does all this. But there’s also I only knew one way to do church.
Yeah. And the way we do church is the way my dad did church because that’s how my church did it. And that was it. It wasn’t, you know, it’s just a naivete. He’s going like, well, I think that’s the only way you’re supposed to do that.
And taking out outside culture and and you’re not talking about, like, preach the word versus, you know, heresy. It’s just, you know, form and function, songs, what songs you sing, what don’t you sing. And so coming out here and then hearing testimonies, in different languages and seeing baptisms of people that there’s, like, baptism becoming real in a sense that you’re not following Jesus. There there’s cost to this. Like, people could lose their family.
They could lose their relationships. And you’re seeing that going like, well, this is real. Yeah. And, there’s a cost to living for the Lord. So it, it it helps you out.
And, also, the the familial side, I mentioned that in in chapel today. Like, this the island’s so familial, and it the states is more independent. And, you know, God bless America. I’m thankful that I live in in America, but we could do to learn that lesson that actually we can live in community and it’s probably better for us. And so, Guam has something.
You can’t just bottle it up. Yeah. If if we could take it back with us, I’d love to. So but it’s hard hard to replace.
Noah Kephart: K. What what was one of the I mean, because you guys were here 2,003, left to go, to to another youth pastor position in 2008. What what was one of the highlights of those 5 years that you spent here at Harvest?
Michael Saunders: So my favorite thing we did was was a Tuesday night bible studies during the summer. And we would have started off with 20, 30 kids that ends up being throughout the summer, like 70, 80, and they’re packed in our little apartment and singing. We did all all the stupid games. We’d have pizza. You’d have snacks and funny things that would happen.
And we had some characters, like, we had to shoo away JJ Havilana, you know, you know, get out of here. So he is one of those amongst the other characters. But, just those times, man, they were sweet. They were sweet, and the relationships that you had, and still have with those guys. Yeah.
They’re I’m not their dad. I’m not their uncle. I feel like I’m just like an older brother. Like, I I love him. Yeah.
And, I’m thankful to watch JJ, what he’s doing now. Yeah. And that’s not to, like to pat him on the back because I rarely try to do that. I wanna make sure I give him a hard time. No.
But to see him now investing in lives in the same way that others were investing in him, just makes me so happy to see him and Morgan just pouring into kid after kid after kid. Yeah. And they’re not paid to do it. They see it because they love Jesus. Yep.
And that’s what you see when people start doing that. When the church just starts loving people, good things happen.
Noah Kephart: Yeah. I mean, you had that in pastor Scott Yeah. Saying follow me as I follow Christ. Yeah. He would come out here, say that to some of the some of the teens, you know, 21 years ago, follow me as I follow Christ.
And there’s a reason that JJ just, you know, pulled on campus and was hanging out with you guys until we, you know, got on the computer.
Michael Saunders: Made him get out of here. Yeah. He he leaves.
Noah Kephart: He had a break. Didn’t wanna get him get him on a mic or anything. But there’s a reason that he’s he’s come back in the house.
Michael Saunders: Chris can only edit so much. JJ, I love you, buddy.
Noah Kephart: So left harvest 2,008. Yes, sir. Where’d you go from here?
Michael Saunders: So I went to Richmond. So the next church, like full time. So in between the youth pastorate, we got back to the states, and the church I did my internship at for college in, Anderson, Indiana called and said, hey, could you come fill in? The pastor’s sick. And so just come for, like, 2, 3 weeks.
So we went there. Then 8 months later, we were still there. But trying to so I was kinda interim preaching Sunday school, Sunday morning, Sunday night, Wednesday night at a small little church. And then went to, the pastor came back healthy. And so then I I left and took a youth pastor in Richmond, Virginia.
K.
Noah Kephart: Alright. And spent how long there?
Michael Saunders: So there are 8 years at Emmanuel Baptist in in Richmond.
Noah Kephart: K. And then you’re in Lexington, Virginia?
Michael Saunders: Yes,
Noah Kephart: sir. What what church? What are you what are you doing there?
Michael Saunders: So it’s Baptist Church. So it was, like, I don’t know what your thought is and how long you feel like you’re gonna be youth pastor till the day you die. But when I was 16, I thought that was that was gonna be the call. Like, hey, I’m just gonna be doing this because that’s what I I wanted to do. Yeah.
And so I’ll when I’m 75, I’ll still be throwing dodgeballs at kids, in doing stuff like that. So it’s actually my wife, when we were in Richmond, that was like, are you sure everything’s good? Like, you’re everything’s alright. I’m like, yeah. Things are great.
Like, you think my thought was rolling well and, like, things are going. She’s like, I don’t think things are alright. Like, no. I think they are. I said, I I think you need to be praying about maybe.
And say, I don’t like, no. Hey. Like, we’re good. Like, we should probably ask less questions. We’re just we’re rolling.
Like, this is we’re we got a good flow here. Let’s keep it going. And so through a loving encouragement from my bride, we went and talked to the senior pastor about, hey. What what was you know, I’m unsure since I was 16 for the first time in my life. I’m wondering, maybe I won’t be 75 in being a youth pastor.
And so what would that look like? And so just encouragement, you probably need to be maybe we have you preach more. And then, my senior pastor, said, Mike, I think you need to start looking for your own church. So and you can be here as long as you want. But I think you start applying because I think the Lord’s probably gonna have you and again, so just submitting to, we went to the authority as as my senior pastor went to him and said, hey.
What do you think? And it’s like, I was hoping he would say like, hey. Why don’t you do this and this and you stick around here? Because I wasn’t looking to be in that spot. Basically, no, I think you need to start praying about that.
And so it took like 2 and a half, 3 years before we actually ended up leaving. But so it was a prompting of my bride, encouragement of my pastor. It’s like you need to do this. And so I went to Lexington, Virginia back in 8 years ago now in September and, started there as a lead pastor and, you know, still is like everything was new, even though I’d seen my dad do it. Now I’m the one filling in.
And people are like, what’s like, you’re joking. Like, what’s what’s the big difference between teens and adults now? You go from youth ministry to senior pastor. It’s like, well, instead of having a teenager having anger problem for 16 years, now they’ve had it for 60. Right?
So it’s just a tougher nut to crack. So you just gotta you gotta spend time with them. But, no. But, you know, so working with adults is different. And so you’re not, obviously, we’re not playing dodgeball, but you’re not playing you’re not they’re not you’re not in their home as much as you would have been.
They’re not in your home as much because they’re professionals. They got stuff going on. Sometimes you’re meeting with them just because of crisis that’s going on. Yeah. And it’s harder.
So where I had a whole youth staff to take care of the teams that we had, now it’s you’re the you’re the guy. And so you have deacons that can help you, but there’s some things when it comes to the spiritual side, they’re gonna wanna talk to just a senior pastor. Yeah. So trying to make those adjustments, you know, through the years, but, man, we’ve seen some neat things happen and, love love where our church is at, and it’s like, we’re we’re at a spot. It’s it’s we’re hitting a sweet stride.
Like, we’re our church family. It’s not the Guam temperature of of familial, but it’s familial. Okay. And they’re they’re living together. They’re serving together.
They’re bringing people, their their workers, their their coworkers, their neighbors, starting to have them come to church, and it’s, it’s sweet to see.
Noah Kephart: K. A lot a lot of acts too going on right there. Yeah. That’s awesome.
Michael Saunders: Love it. That’s awesome.
Noah Kephart: So I didn’t ask about kids. How many kids do you have?
Michael Saunders: We have 3. K. Ages? So Hudson will be 15 this month. K.
Austin is 13, and baby girl, McKenna, is 9. Austin. There should be 10 in November.
Noah Kephart: K. So That’s fun.
Michael Saunders: Big change. Yeah. That’s great. I love them. K.
Noah Kephart: We’ll come together. We’re we’re thankful, to have you out here, for spirit week. And and you’ve been no stranger to harvest over the years. You’ve come out a couple times, thankful to have you out here for spirit week, just encouraging our our teens, challenging them, pointing them to Jesus, what Jesus says. And, yeah.
Looking forward to a great week with you. Any anything else to add as we as we sign off here?
Michael Saunders: Well, I’d like to thank you know, obviously, pastor Gary and Ken, you know, they were allowing me to come. But, you know, I’m thankful. You come back and things things are different, and that’s good. There’s different people in the church, and there’s more people in the church. There’s people that have invited people to come to church.
And so just as, you know, the Harvest family, just to realize that that that same thing that pastor Scott did for me, if you just will love people where they’re at and spend time with them, and you keep pointing them to Jesus, you’re gonna see good things. There’s gonna come good fruit coming out of that. And so attending Sunday morning, like both services, jet lagged. So the second one made more sense in the first. Like, I was trying I was like, man, trying to pay attention, so we just got off the the plane the night before.
But, but just looking, watching the people coming in and seeing some of the some of that change with different dynamics in the church body and church family and seeing people hugging on, loving each other, and hearing their stories of I was invited by or I got to invite, hey, this is my friend. They’re coming from work and going, keep doing the work. Your the impact you can have. So whether you’re you’re working at UOG or whether you’re working for the government here, you’re working military, or if you’re working here at the school, if you just will love on the person that’s next to you, that you have an opportunity to reach, that that you won’t be able to reach. Right?
Like, you’re not gonna be able to reach their coworker like they will. Yep. And And so just to see them loving on their family and friends and neighbors enough to say, hey, can I just be with you and talk to you about who Jesus is and and keep inviting you to come? We got great things going, and and he really does have the answer for your life. And so that that’s just, I guess, encourage you to keep it up because it’s sweet to see.
Noah Kephart: Yeah. And
Michael Saunders: so you love coming back because this is where Rebecca and I, this is our first ministry together. So it’s sweet to be back here, but it’s even better to see the church being the church.
Noah Kephart: Yep. Oh, it’s fun it’s fun to watch from from my perspective and you coming back after so many years. Fun to see from your perspective. Well, I’m sure. So alright.
Well, thanks for being on
Michael Saunders: y’all Thursday. Chris, thanks for your work. You’re great, buddy.
Chris Harper: Thank you. And thank you for listening to Harvest Time. Of course, at this point in the program, we always wanna personally invite you again to services at Harvest Baptist Church. You’re gonna see some of that familial atmosphere that we talked about, today, and that happens at 8:45 AM and 10:45 AM. And then, of course, this week, we’re launching community groups.
So folks are meeting, in different neighborhoods and different villages, throughout the island in the afternoon. You can check on that when you come to one of our services at 8:45 AM or 10:45 AM. During the 10:45 AM service, you can hear that broadcast live here on 88.1 FM or on khmg.org. We do hope to see you this week, at Harvest Baptist Church. Thanks again for listening to Harvest Time.